Mark Cooper

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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby voodoobluesman » Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:17 pm

Both I'd expect.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Chrisgump11 » Mon Jan 13, 2020 4:39 pm

People deal with abuse in different ways. Dale is phlegmatic and rarely comments, Mark is the sort of character who will always respond. Nothing wrong with that. I prefer the former's approach so far as unspecific stuff is concerned but the abuse aimed at Mark has been personal and has included his family. You'd have to be a saint to put up with that.

I contacted Mark today to say that 99.9% of us stand with him. He was appreciative but made it clear how keenly he feels about the constant personal abuse he is getting. I felt disgusted for him

Why shouldn't he react? Would you call responding to racial abuse 'unprofessional'? It is 2 sides of the same coin - the shame is on the abuser not the abused. And Mark made it clear he was calling out the abusers not FGR supporters as a whole. HE is the victim so direct your fire at those who have targeted him.

Moreover, I think the tide is turning on the abusive few. At home games, the East Stand is finding its voice, partly as a result of the childish silence by some South Standers and partly as a reaction to abuse of Mark & Dale. The abusers have increasingly, been booed and called out by supporters all over the ground. These wretched few have no support base other than personal prejudice

For Pete's sake, we are FGR. We are better than this. A traditionally friendly small club who applaud our opponents supporters and welcome them to our rural county.

So, what should we do? And what should Mark do? As for us, let's all get braver to shout down the abuse. If needs be, call the stewards attention - that's what they are for. If we allow this nastiness to continue, it tarnishes us all. As for Mark, I would not expect him to stay quiet. But I would recommend that he encourages TRUE supporters to be intolerant of the abusers.

Finally, let this latest episode be a red line. A turning point. Take every opportunity to show Mark we support him against disgusting abuse and will turn the heat on those dishing it out
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby DIESEL » Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:48 pm

Dale has held out an olive branch on more than one occasion encouraging the few to come forward and have an adult conversation about their issues. More than the majority of Chairman would do.
In all honesty, for all there ranting I am still unclear as to what outcome they ultimately want? All very well shouting about what they don’t like. How about talking about what you would like, in detail, directly to the right people, face to face.

The best way I can think of in terms of asking them questions, is for all the board, playing staff and the players to walk across to the South Stand and ask them a few questions directly. All in a friendly non confrontational way. The likelihood is you will be able to hear a pin drop. Have video cameras on hand and if people start hailing abuse then they are banned.
May sound a bit unrealistic but I am getting pretty fed up.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Norton Boy » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:01 pm

From what i have seen,they want Cooper out Vince out the 2000 newer fans out and the club in the Southern league.Oh and i guess a nice shiny badge each with True Fan written on it.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby The Game Within » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:20 pm

Norton Boy I don't think the majority of them know exactly what they want they sing and shout to follow just a few. I witnessed them on Saturday and I would say most were only in short trousers when DV was asked to come in and save the club from going under.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Norton Boy » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:29 pm

I was being somewhat tongue in cheek but yes you are right,many don't even remember the old ground but are impressionable and follow what a few older ones say.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Silver Surfer » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:37 pm

Norton Boy wrote:From what i have seen,they want Cooper out Vince out the 2000 newer fans out and the club in the Southern league.Oh and i guess a nice shiny badge each with True Fan written on it.

Great idea. Bring back Alan Lewer as manager, and monthly whip-rounds to pay the wages.
No animals were harmed during the creation of this message, but some electrons became agitated.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby DIESEL » Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:58 pm

Norton Boy wrote:From what i have seen,they want Cooper out Vince out the 2000 newer fans out and the club in the Southern league.Oh and i guess a nice shiny badge each with True Fan written on it.


Without repeating myself this is exactly the point.
Everyone hears what they are saying. But:
If they want the chairman out, who do they want to replace him?
If they want the manger out, who do they want to replace him?
If they want the players out, who do they want to replace them?
We all hear the noise but I don’t hear their plan!!!
Last edited by DIESEL on Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby It is now » Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:01 pm

I was fortunate enough to be a Forest season ticket holder during the glory years. Clough was marmite, some loved him and some loathed him (mainly because of his time at Derby County) but he did wonders for the team and the city. He famously had a huge sign made and put in front of the Trent End which said
“Gentlemen no swearing ... Brian”

Amazingly the fans obliged.

When it was later rumoured he was leaving another sign appeared

“Brian -no leaving ... the Gentlemen” . He obliged too.

Just a thought !!
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby TreeinWillsbridge » Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:11 am

:D
The childish bunch in the South Stand don't know when they're well off!

Dale could sell out to some one like Fawaz :o now that idiot would take them straight to where they profess to want to go?
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Foreign Green » Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:33 pm

As an outsider (never been at TNL let alone the old Lawn) I may sound arrogant when giving my point of view about the issue (as I was condemned in the topic "Unbelievable hatred").

In Finnish language there´s a word "myötähäpeä" (somewhere near "vicarious embarrassment") describing the emotion You feel for someone, who doesn´t understand to be ashamed, though he should.
I think, that´s the case about those South Standers.

As I said before, it might be hopeless to try to adapt them to the majority of supporters and get behind the team. They don´t want to. Facts and logic don´t matter. I´ve been told, also the club have given them enough chances to express themselves. Waste of time and energy.
The only means might be to meet them one by one, discuss face to face - but who wants voluntarily to take that arduous and still uncertain task?

It´s mainly a question of identity policy. Anti-Vince, Anti-Cooper, Anti Eco Park (and in larger scale anti-vegan, anti-environment, pro-rightwing etc., a part of the global conservative movement). They might consider themselves as "true fans", though some of them we pooing their pants when FGR played in the old Lawn.

You could just stand them. Though we don´t know, how long they are going to continue their silly and obnoxious performance. Maybe they will tire in some day and quit. Especially, if they are totally ignored.
But because it´s a question of their identity, they might feel themselves as "freedom-fighters" and stay there "till the bitter end."

If they are disturbing not only MC, but also the majority of decent fans, it could be better to try to get rid of them.

Don´t know the lawful aspects. Generally, spectators booing, shouting and expressing their spontaneous negative feelings is allowed in sports. Also criticism. And people in certain high positions, celebrities, politicians, club-owners and managers are obliged to face and stand more criticism than average John Does and Joe Sixpacks.

But is constant public insulting and using real names criticism and normal stadium behaviour? Hardly. There might be a righteous chance to bring a legal action against them.
Also breaking the rules of the club might be a reason to ban them - if the rules are level with the common law.

But would it be worth it? We can be sure, what a massive outcry would be raised, if even one of those protestors were banned, let alone taken into court. He would be introduced as a hero, a martyr of free speech, an innocent victim of the the unscrupulous tyrant. Supported by peer-morons in social media (and at least in Cheltenham´s forum ;) ).

So are there any means left? Don´t know.
How many are them, 20, 50 or 100? If there were more than 2000 decent supporters at TNL, it wouldn´t be impossible to humiliate them in human way. 300-500 vocal singers would be enough to beat their filthy spectacle:
"Hit the road, jerks, and don´t You come back no more, no more, no more..." Or simply (simple weapons to simple opponents): "Go home morons, go home morons..."
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Lady Magpie » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:01 pm

They are already breaking the law within seconds of opening their mouths. Their vile and disgusting language would have them arrested outside for swearing, haven't you ever watched a police programme.

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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Tim13 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:25 pm

Chants along the lines of “sit down, shut up!” or “it’s past your bedtime!” could well express our feelings without resorting to bad language or a slanging match.

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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Tommo » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:30 pm

I think we need to be careful when using the term South Standers. It is by no means all of the vocal group and I suspect the ringleaders for the swearing, sweary chants and anti Dale/MC chants are very small in number. Hopefully that small group will get bored soon and get on board or go off and annoy some other team's support. Its sad cos when they are in good voice and thinking positively, they are a real asset but on Saturday it was embarrassing and I felt very sorry for those who had brought their youngsters along and had to move and keep their ears covered.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby 20yrs and counting » Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:46 pm

Agree 98% of South Standers vocal in the right way, urging on players and management. I reckon probably only around 20 attention seekers believing they are more important than the rest of us.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby tommyd » Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:01 pm

I used to be so proud to be a ‘south stander’ we were loud in the right way and the atmosphere was always great fun. I really don’t enjoy it there now and despite having a season ticket I often contemplate not bothering with games. It’s just not fun in there anymore. I came to football to escape the negativity and division of the ‘real world’ and it’s being ruined by a couple of spoiled little kids...
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Tomiswalking » Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:59 pm

tommyd wrote:I used to be so proud to be a ‘south stander’ we were loud in the right way and the atmosphere was always great fun. I really don’t enjoy it there now and despite having a season ticket I often contemplate not bothering with games. It’s just not fun in there anymore. I came to football to escape the negativity and division of the ‘real world’ and it’s being ruined by a couple of spoiled little kids...


That's tough mate.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby mauler » Wed Jan 15, 2020 7:17 am

Interesting how the Finnish word is quite like myopia. That is definitely something that the potty mouths suffer from.

I am equally bewildered with thes childish need to antagonize opponent fans with the tired "your support is sub-optimal" chant.

Joking aside, no one would mind if these Herbert's got kicked out which is secretly what they want so they can give it large on their social media. I would oblige them.
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Tommo » Wed Jan 15, 2020 7:48 am

Tomiswalking wrote:
tommyd wrote:I used to be so proud to be a ‘south stander’ we were loud in the right way and the atmosphere was always great fun. I really don’t enjoy it there now and despite having a season ticket I often contemplate not bothering with games. It’s just not fun in there anymore. I came to football to escape the negativity and division of the ‘real world’ and it’s being ruined by a couple of spoiled little kids...


That's tough mate.


How about setting up in the North Stand of coming to the East Stand and giving some vocal support from there? I have the same issues as you at away games
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Re: Mark Cooper

Postby Tj1889 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 7:58 am

Are we seeing a mirror of wider society? A small but very vocal group of anger driven right wing protesters? Ideals driven by a rose tinted view of the past?
I think the questions we are debating here are the same ones being debated all over the country. I believe the only remedy is for reasonable people to stand firm and make themselves heard.
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