Eating Less Meat

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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby gooseman » Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:32 pm

I was lucky to go to China in 2016 and what I saw made me realise that you can do your bit but ultimately it is probably futile. Traveling along the Yangtze, you saw power station, after power station using coal being brought up the river by barge after barge. The C02 being produced was simply amazing. The mega construction long side cities next to the river was massive. In 2016 China had 70% 0f all known cranes in use. It was staggering. Then you get to the three gorges dam complex. Entire cities of million plus dwellers moved to accommodate this amazing feat of engineering.
Then very little is said about the biggest threat and that is population growth. It is totally unsustainable The estimated growth just in Africa is truly staggering. Estimates of Nigeria population by 2050 rising to 400 million. Will the next big war be about water and not oil.
Eating less meat is like sticking your finger in the dam to stop that small leak , except the whole dam is collapsing around you. :o
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Pitchfork » Tue Oct 16, 2018 4:18 pm

You are right gooseman, China is a huge problem; it releases almost as much carbon dioxide as the U. S. and Europe combined. The Chinese government has taken steps to limit coal use, but its emissions do and will continue to rise.

Europe and the U.S. should gradually ban coal power, tax carbon heavily, reduce meat consumption and spend lots of money on building green energy infrastructure. But without a huge change in China, none of that will matter -- the battle against climate change will be lost.

To a large extent, the fate of the planet is now out of the developed world’s hands. So what do we do? There has to be a technology transfer to enable China to replace coal with solar and wind power. In the meantime Europe must set a good example by embracing the Kyoto Protocols & Paris Agreement.

gooseman wrote:Eating less meat is like sticking your finger in the dam to stop that small leak , except the whole dam is collapsing around you. :o


The world is wakening up to the problem at long last, the UK is not doing anywhere near enough but the more that happens at grassroots the better. The government is picking up on the fact people care and they will not lose votes by becoming more green. Forest Green's efforts have been pioneering, a role model club in the sports world. The global publicity about FGR's efforts has been staggering - the impact of this finger in the dam has made a difference.

More and more individuals, families, businesses, councils and organisations are 'sticking their fingers in the dam'. Hopefully, for the sake of future generations, it won't be too little too late.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby gooseman » Tue Oct 16, 2018 6:12 pm

Pitchfork your points are duly noted but I see nothing in your response regarding population growth. That is the key issue. Eating less meat will have a minimal impact, whereas the estimated population growth is the "clear and present danger". Until this issue is recognised, I'm sorry but regardless of what you and others say we will be* p-----g into the wind".
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Timb » Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:17 pm

Pretty much as expected then.

Eating Less Meat not worth bothering with by most posts.

It might be embarrassing to recommend eating less meat or to suggest it would be a good idea to do so, in case you get caught eating meat.

Irrelevant because of bigger problems elsewhere on carbon emissions.

So don't bother.

A bit depressing really. We're all doomed ......

Frack Away.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Pitchfork » Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:02 pm

gooseman wrote:Pitchfork your points are duly noted but I see nothing in your response regarding population growth. That is the key issue.


Hi gooseman, as 'Eating Less Meat' was the thread title, I thought I'd gone off on a tangent enough.

No doubt human population growth is a major contributor to global warming, given that we use fossil fuels to power our increasingly mechanized lifestyles.

Our numbers grew from 1.6 billion to 6.1 billion people during the course of the 20th century. (Think about it: It took all of time for population to reach 1.6 billion; then it shot to 6.1 billion over just 100 years.) During that time emissions of CO2, the leading greenhouse gas, grew 12-fold. And with worldwide population expected to surpass nine billion over the next 50 years, we should be worried about the ability of the planet to withstand the added load of greenhouse gases entering the atmosphere and wreaking havoc on ecosystems down below.

I can't understand why population growth isn't mentioned more often gooseman, you are right it is a key issue. I guess the way to control it is by educating families in developing countries about birth control options....but i'm sure its a lot more complicated than that.

Like you I try to travel, I am impressed by the actions many countries, communities and families are to counteract climate change. I totally understand your argument about China & population growth but as a 'glass half full person', I don't think we're all doomed and it's worth preaching the green agenda.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby voodoobluesman » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:14 pm

That’s right Timb. This is why we’re doomed.

Take the red pill and sod the consequences.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby greenwanderer » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:18 pm

http://www.cowspiracy.com/blog/2015/11/ ... racy-facts

"The most astonishing number in the film – 51 % of the GHGs are created by livestock – comes from a non-peer-reviewed article (Goodland and Anhang, 2009). Why did you use this report without mentioning the criticism against it?"
The Goodland/Anhang analysis was peer-reviewed. In order for employees of the World Bank to do any press or have articles published they must have it cleared by the World Bank first. Goodland and Anhang used the global standard for measuring GHGs http://www.ghgprotocol.org/city-accounting, something that the FAO report did not even do.

"The figure that says that animal agriculture is responsible for 18 % of Greenhouse Gases (GHG), but the FAO has since corrected their calculations to 14.5 % "

51% may be false, but 14.5-18% stiil accounts for a sizeable proportion (that equals to the amount of carbon emission from transportation). If it's true, having a plant-based diet still have a big impact.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Timb » Sun Oct 28, 2018 8:25 pm

No meat today. Stuffed cabbage in tomato sauce. Didn't appeal to the other half until she smelt them cooking while I was listening to the Arsenal game.

Fry up onions with garlic and add equal amount of chopped mushrooms with sage and rosemary and Cook till it's a dry mix. Then add red wine and Cook down again. dry roast some pine nuts and mix with seasoned rice cooked before. Squeeze into balls and wrap in Savoy cabbage leaves.

Cook up a tomato onion garlic and red wine sauce.

Shove the stuffed cabbage leaves in a dish and pour in the sauce and shove in the oven for 30 mins.

Griddle some whole fennel in olive oil till brown and roast in a separate tray alongside.

The verdict was very rich and very delicious and meat not missed. I'm going to do it again.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Silver Surfer » Sun Oct 28, 2018 11:32 pm

Do we need a recipe forum? That sounds delicious.
No animals were harmed during the creation of this message, but some electrons became agitated.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby GETCARTER » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:58 am

Timb - with a recipe like that you should be on Celebrity Chef. Look forward to your next meal suggestion.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Chrisgump11 » Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:07 pm

Wow Tim!

Can we expect a 'chef's corner' developing on the site? Or maybe recipes set to verse on 'poets corner'?
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Pitchfork » Thu Nov 01, 2018 7:44 am

Our forum has certainly moved on substantially since the days of 'Bring back our burgers'

For the majority of FGR fans, respect and understanding has replaced fear and loathing

Interesting article:

https://theconversation.com/vegans-why- ... t%20eaters
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Timb » Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:21 am

Yet more national and global coverage of the climate change issues associated with meat production and consumption recently.

Has anyone on this forum taken anything on board from the coverage that would make them consider eating less meat or are we all still in the "there's nothing wrong with smoking 20 a day" mode?
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Timb » Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:24 pm

Fennel Pasta.

Chop up a bulb of fennel into 8 wedges and other small bits off the top. Fry or griddle in rapeseed oil (it doesn't burn or smoke like olive oil until a much higher temperature) until it is golden. Turn it off.

Make a pesto out of tomato puree fennel seeds chilli almonds oil salt and pepper. Set aside.

Chop up 2 cloves of garlic, 6 spring onions, birds eye chilli. Zest a lemon.

Chop up 2 big handfuls of parsley. The more the better.

Go down the social network and watch a derby of your choosing on Sky with the trouble and strife and some friends. Maybe eat some peanuts. Agree what time to come home and don't drink too much.

Put a pot of water on and bring to boil. Sort out what time to put pasta on.

Fry up garlic spring onions chilli and zest a lemon for 4 mins. Fry in rapeseed oil till taking colour and add a glass of white wine and reduce down to thick. 6 mins Max plus.

Add cooked fennel and fennel pesto and mix.

Add salt and pepper to taste.

Add cooked pasta. lunguini or whatever you fancy.

Add juice of a lemon squeezed over the top. Salt ans pepper on the table.

Serve in big bowls with crusty bread.

Lovely. No meat and no Quorn.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby cookiemonster » Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:46 am

So the courts will be asked to decide if 'ethical veganism' is a philosophical belief https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46385597
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby paulK » Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:41 pm

Timb wrote:Yet more national and global coverage of the climate change issues associated with meat production and consumption recently.

Has anyone on this forum taken anything on board from the coverage that would make them consider eating less meat or are we all still in the "there's nothing wrong with smoking 20 a day" mode?


Whilst I read and learn, I don't think I'm really influenced.

My meat consumption has been reduced through diet, but I have to admit it wasn't anything to do with global warming.

To me, the issues are complex. It's not just meat production and consumption. Also, there are pluses and minuses to any decision. I 'm not sure I know enough about the minuses.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Greeners » Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:15 pm

Hi
Simple question.
If everyone stopped eating meat, what effect would it have on Global Warning
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Fartvs Antiqvvs » Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:27 pm

Greeners wrote:Hi
Simple question.
If everyone stopped eating meat, what effect would it have on Global Warning


No simple answer to that, I fear Greeners. :shock:
Quo tendimus?

Nos venit!
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby GETCARTER » Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:09 pm

Timb, love the recipes ........keep them coming !.
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Re: Eating Less Meat

Postby Theoperator » Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:37 pm

Im confused here, cows are bad is it mainly because they release methane or is it so that awful eyesores like Minch and Rodborough Commons have to exist yet if we eat more onions brussels and other brassicas it appears that more methane is produced. :oops:

Theres many more humans than cows, it doesnt seem to add up :oops:

And why get rid of beekeeping, when they contribute a lot to the environment :?
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